Thursday, May 14, 2009


I'm not posting a Lost-related grammar error here today. Instead, since we won't get to see our favorite hot redneck for several months (son of a bitch!), I thought I'd post this little piece of eye candy here instead...

Much cuter than a grammar error, right?

Also, at Red Pen, Inc. reader PHRANK's request, here's some eye candy for the guys, too...

So, the finale... Um, HOLY CRAP. This may have been my favorite Lost episode ever. It also might be the episode that made me scream the most. At the end of the episode, I let out the most pitiful howl. Seriously. I'm going to try to make this post somewhat coherent, but I have no idea if I'll succeed. My mind is still going a million times a minute, you know? Regardless, here are my thoughts on the episode (these are based on the actual notes I took while watching--because yeah, this time there was so freakin' much going on that I actually had to take notes!):

* I'd heard a rumor that what's-his-face who plays the asshole ex-husband in Dexter was going to be Jacob in an episode of Lost. At first I had a difficult time taking him seriously as Jacob because all I could think was, "Hey, there's that wife-beating douchebag!" Once I got over that, I think he did a pretty decent job, although I somehow envisioned Jacob as being more exciting. He seemed sort of bland, you know? Like, why is this guy so damn special and revered on the island? (Perhaps a question for season 6...)

* We got to see a pretty decent glimpse (side-profile-ish) of the statue! It really did look a lot like Anubis. And was it holding an ankh?

* Was that ship that Jacob and the other dude were watching...the Black Rock? And what the hell was their cryptic conversation all about? Also: I could have sworn the not-Jacob dude looked familiar, but I couldn't place him. Is he someone we've ever seen before?

* So then we saw that Jacob had interactions with several of the castaways prior to their time on the island. We first saw Jacob interact with young Kate; later on, we saw him interact with young Sawyer, plus Sun and Jin, Hurley, Sayid, Jack, and Locke. This is interesting, because we've all been picking apart so much of what we've seen of Lost this season, but they're starting to make us come up with new theories because now we're starting to consider what we haven't seen or been shown. Did any of you guess that these folks had met Jacob in their off-island lives already? I hadn't. I was too busy analyzing what I'd seen in the show to start wondering about what they hadn't showed me had already happened to the characters.

* I could have sworn, when Ilana and company were on that kayak, that they were gonna get shot at. Remember the episode a while back in season 5 where the castaways were shooting at unknown people on a kayak-type boat? Looks like I got that theory wrong...

* Ilana and her buddies have a box. Lapidus is freaked out about what's in the box. I was fairly certain that it was Locke's body, although I wasn't sure how that could be possible. It saw sort of like season 4 all over again, with being teased about something being in a box (coffin) and us not being quite sure who or what it was.

* Juliet...was awesome tonight. She was just superb in all the scenes she was in tonight. I loved how she corrected Sawyer on the sub, saying that it was "we" who wanted to leave the island, and then her putting the plans in motion to get that sub back to the island. Nice work, Juliet.

* Jack, who used to think Locke was nuts, told Richard--when Richard told Jack that Locke had never seemed particularly special to him--to not give up on Locke. Hmmm, will Jack eventually end up eating those words? (Since now it seems like there are two Lockes running around, and one of them is kinda creepy-ish and bad?)

* I was disappointed that (until the end of the episode) Ben wasn't given too much to do. He looked appropriately shocked when Locke told him that he (Ben) needed to kill Jacob. This brought back memories of season 2: Ben making Locke kill his own dad (even though Sawyer was the one who really killed Locke's father). Now, I suppose, Locke is kinda getting even for that.

* Was Ellie really the leader of the hostiles at one point? That's what Richard said, but that seemed strange to me. I never got a "leader" vibe from her.

* I about flipped the fuck out when Sayid got shot. Is he a goner, or is he gonna be OK for season 6?

* I knew--just knew--Vincent would show up in this episode.

* And then we found out that Rose and Bernard have had their own little happy hippie commune in the forest, away from everyone else. I really like those two. I wish we'd gotten to see more of them in this season. At least now their absence has been explained. And really, Bernard's "Son of a bitch!" totally made me giggle.

* Right before Lapidus made his point about not believing anyone who has to say they're the good guys, I was thinking the same thing. I don't really trust Ilana and her friends. The guys seem like jackasses. I'm still not entirely sure what those people are up to. But we did find out that Ilana knows Jacob...

* Jacob's living in the foot of the freakin' statue? Really?

* Another note on Jacob: There was a scene (when he was sitting outside, and Locke was busy being pushed out a window) where he was reading something. It was Flannery O'Connor's Everything That Rises Must Converge. Hmmm...I wonder what significance that might have...

* I loved the moment when Sun found Charlie's DriveShaft ring in the crib. Precious.

* Those Apollo candy bars that we saw on the island in previous seasons made an appearance in the vending machine at Jack's hospital; that was the excuse Jacob had for talking to Jack.

* At first I was thrilled that Sawyer was having such a mature conversation with Jack in the woods. Then he beat the living snot out of Jack. Ahhh, the Sawyer of season 1 is briefly back, haha.

* Juliet broke my heart in the woods when she was talking to Sawyer, telling him that she'd be OK with Jack using the bomb to make it so that Oceanic 815 made it back to LA safely, meaning that she'd never have met Sawyer--because, as she put it, if she'd never met him, then she'd never have to lose him. That killed me. Haven't we all been there at some point, thinking that very same thought, wanting to completely forget someone we cared about because that person had hurt us too badly for us to deal with it?

* I loved how the guitar case that Hurley brought on the plane actually came from Jacob. Also: Jacob made it clear that Hurley had a choice to make about whether or not he wanted to go on the Ajira flight. Interesting that Jacob, who seemed to give so many orders on the island, was focused on how this was a choice (not an order) for Hurley.

* So Chang turned out to not be such an ass after all--he was trying to save everyone, and it appears that Miles, in turn, saved him. (All together now: Awww!)

* Looks like that annoying creep Phil got death by scaffolding. Was it wrong of me to laugh at that scene? Because I totally freakin' did.

* I thought that Juliet had died when she'd gone down the (what do you call it--hatch? tunnel? hole? You know what I mean...). God, that scene with her and Sawyer was heartbreaking. I've been Team Skate all along, but man...I didn't want to see her go like that, although admittedly, it was an absolutely brilliant scene, and Sawyer looked appropriately devastated.

* We finally find out who can answer Ilana's question: "What lies in the shadow of the statue?". Richard--er, Ricardo--can! And he answers it in Latin. Unfortunately, it's been a few years since I took Latin, so I have no effin' clue what he said.

* Sun and I, and probably all of you, were thinking the same thing: If that's Locke in that box, and that Locke is just a dead body, then who's in that statue right now with Ben and Jacob? That, I'm sure, will be a major component of season 6...

* Jacob to Locke: "You found your loophole." In time, like to travel back to the island? Or was there something more to that question...?

* Jacob was so very cold to Ben. After the kindnesses we'd seen Jacob display with the castaways when he met them off-island, this coldness was kind of a surprise. ("What about me?" Ben asked, after a pretty passionate speech to Jacob. "Well, what about you?" Jacob answered. At which point, Ben stabbed him and then Locke pushed Jacob into the fire.)

* When Jacob said to Locke, "They're coming," what was that all about? Did he mean Ilana's people? Or other people? It sounded like he was afraid of these people...

* And then, in the final moments of the final episode of season 5, we find out that Juliet is not dead (at least at that moment), and she manages to make that bomb work, and then everything...goes to WHITE. Which is about when I started howling.

So now it seems like Jacob is dead, and I'm assuming that Juliet is also dead (how could she not be?). The rest of the characters we know and love seem OK (right? Except for possibly Sayid?). While this finale gave us a lot of information, it also left a lot of questions hanging. Will Sun and Jin reunite? I was hoping that would happen in this episode, and it didn't. Also: What's Desmond have to do with all of this? We didn't see him in this finale, which totally surprised me.

How did you like the finale? What were your favorite moments? Where do you think Season 6 is going? Talk to me in the comments section...

Also: For your reading pleasure, here's Doc Jensen's Lost finale recap. Brilliant stuff, as usual!


April said...

I only have like 10 seconds so I'll be back later to finish reading this and give my thoughts. You know I have them. :) But the loophole - remember back at the beginning of the episode when Jacob and the other guy were on the beach and other guy told Jacob he was going to kill him and they mentioned finding a loophole - to what I don't know - some kind of agreement they had I guess? It seems other guy found his loophole, coming back in Locke's body and using that to get Ben close enough to Jacob to kill him.

My mind was completely blown. Sorry if you already mentioned any of the above but I really just scanned the post. I'll be back later.

Ranielle said...

Despite having a migraine, I managed to stay awake for the finale. Yay! Although I am equally boo-hiss about the whole thing, since it seems that we will not get any more "LOST" until 20-effing-10. My only hope is that this also means that Season 6 is going to be COMPLETELY UNINTERRUPTED.

Funny little note before I dive in, did anyone else notice in the opening credits that Part 1 was written by "Damon Lindelof & Carlton Cuse" and that Part 2 was written by "Carlton Cuse & Damon Lindelof"? WTF?

Moving on...

* Thank you, Nikki, for the eye candy. It is always much appreciated. Not that I don't love grammar posts, but shirtless Sawyer is right up there on the reasons-to-check-the-Internet list.

* My first question when I saw the statue was, "Is that an ankh?" So, yes, I do think the statue was holding one.

* Is it significant that Jacob is a weaver? It made me think of the three sisters of Fate, weaving threads of life, measuring them, and then cutting them. It also made me think of Rumpelstiltskin and Sleeping Beauty, since he was spinning on a spinning wheel, but I don't know if that's really significant.

* I didn't even THINK about The Black Rock, but that the ship Jacob and not-Jacob saw off the coast was probably it. Stands to reason. I'm also of a mind that Ricardos -- aka, Richard -- comes off that ship.

* Did anyone else remember shadowy-not-seen-Jacob from episodes past being rather beefier and more beardy? As in, looking more like the not-Jacob guy? The whole episode I was convinced that this not-Jacob guy was impersonating Jacob somehow.

* I think I was kind of right that not-Jacob was impersonating someone. When Jacob told evil, creepy Locke that he'd found a loophole, I believe he was referring back to the scene at the beginning of the episode when not-Jacob told Jacob he wanted to kill him and he was going to find a way to do it. Locke isn't really alive; this not-Jacob entity is impersonating Locke for the purposes of getting Ben to kill Jacob because, for whatever reason, he can't do it himself.

* Out-there theory: Jacob and not-Jacob are some sort of god-like entities, battling something out down here with the mortals. Maybe they've been banished from whatever Olympus-like place they come from. Maybe other gods are the "they" that Jacob referred to as coming; coming to put an end to this nonsense once and for all because Jacob and not-Jacob are causing too much trouble. Jacob believes that mortals can exist happily and without warfare in some sort of perfect society, not-Jacob obviously disagrees, and the source of their animosity towards one another is a love/hate for mortals. Perhaps Jacob tried to banish not-Jacob from the Island. That line of ash around Jacob's cabin had been broken/breached when Ilana and Co. arrived there, and a swatch of cloth had been posted to the wall with a knife. Could this have been the doing of not-Jacob, some sort of beware-for-I-can-get-to-you warning for Jacob to heed?

* So Jacob visited our main characters some time in their past off the Island. Little Kate was told never to steal again; she did. She had to go to the Island. Little Sawyer was given the pencil to finish his letter; he didn't finish it. He had to go to the Island. Sun and Jin were told never to take their love for granted; they did. They had to go to the Island. Hurley was given the choice to return. He chose to go to the Island. Jacob told Jack that the candy machine just "needed a little push"; but it was really Jack that needed the push. He went back to the Island. Jacob offers no ultimatums or platitudes to Sayid, but Jacob is the distraction that causes Sayid to turn his back on Nadia long enough for her to get hit by that car. Driven by a guy that was hired by Widmore, according to Ben. But was it really Widmore? Nadia being dead causes Sayid to work as an assassin for Ben, which we think is why Ilana arrests him, being hired by the family of one of the men he killed. But Ilana is actually working for Jacob, it seems, so maybe this was Jacob's plan all along to get Sayid back to the Island. Locke... I'm not sure about Locke. Didn't it look like Jacob's touch brought him back to life? Jacob's sorry about what happened to Locke, but tells him that everything's going to be all right. We think that Locke found his purpose on the Island, but if the new (evil?) Locke turns out to not even be him, then I'm not so sure. Also, did you notice that Jacob had to TOUCH each and every one of them?

* With all of his daddy issues, Ben was basically told by Jacob, "You're insignificant." In the grand scheme of things, maybe Ben was never meant to be the leader of the Others. Maybe he was a placeholder until Locke arrived. Maybe when he thought he was being manipulated by Jacob, he was being manipulated by not-Jacob, who was just trying to set things into motion to find that loophole he's been after for years/millennia/eons.

* There was an old lady who lived in a shoe. And there was a strange Island entity who lived in the foot of a statue. Like you do.

* Juliet. I've never been much of a fan of hers, but I gotta say, she brought me to tears TWICE in this episode. And when they panned down the not-yet-hatch, I just knew that she was still alive (shyeah, right, 'cause that's totally possible) and that she was going to beat the hell out of the bomb in order to make it go off. Because the episode HAD to end with the bomb detonating.

* Anyone else think Miles' theory about the bomb actually being the incident that fucks everything up might actually hold water? 'Cause he may not be too far off the mark. If "whatever happened, happened," then maybe in the crazy time loop of the Island they had always gone back and had always detonated a bomb which had always later caused Flight 815 to go down.

* Because, really, if their plane never goes down, they never land on the Island. If they never land on the Island, they never get off the Island. If they never get off the Island, they never go back to the Island. If they never go back to the Island, they never jump back in time. If they never jump back in time, they never detonate the hydrogen bomb. Ah, the joys of time travel.

* I think it was Doc Jensen who had been writing about Season 4 mirroring Season 3, and Season 5 mirroring Season 2. Whether or not the bomb detonating in 1977 changes anything, I think we can expect Season 6 to mirror Season 1.

* I'm not sure we can count on anyone, except perhaps Juliet, as being dead. We never saw the light leave Jacob's eyes, so to speak. And as we know from Sayid shooting Little Ben, no one should be presumed dead until they're buried; and even then... And Jack, Kate and Sawyer and Co. were all well within the blast range of a hydrogen bomb. If they're not blasted back to LAX in 2004 or mid-flight on Oceanic 815, that's got to have some serious health consequences.

* Along with not seeing Desmond, I was disappointed not to see Christian or even Claire as Ilana was poking around Jacob's cabin.

I think that's it from me for now. I will be very much looking forward to this season being released on DVD, and once I round out my collection with Season 3, I may hole up for the entire month of December to prepare myself for The End.


I, too, only have about 10 seconds, so I will be back to respond to these insightful comments in a little bit, when I am able to give them the time they deserve! :) (Back around 11 or so, and I can't WAIT to respond to both of you then, as you have both made some really awesome points!)

Andrew said...

Juliet's not dead. Remember when Desmond turned the key and there was a blast and a white light? He turned out fine.

Perhaps the "bomb" worked and season 6 begins with all the characters (including charlie, charlie, shannon, boone, etc?) flying from syndey to LA. Maybe the rest of the season is them meeting each other for the "first time." Or maybe not.

"Locke" was definitely some manifestation of Jacob's nemesis from the opening clip. Pretty cool twist, if I do say so myself.

Richard's Latin response was: "He who will protect/save us all."

Gotta love Rose and Bernard and seeing Vincent again. Its the little things sometimes that make you happy.

Stunning episode with lots to think about. The whole Jacob being a real "person" instead of made up is pretty cool. Also gotta love the new and improved (and more submissive and depressed) Ben.

The next 8 months will be painful...

April said...

Wow. Great stuff Ranielle. A lot of that is the same stuff I got from the episode too but I did not connect the dots to the people that he touched not doing what they were told. That must be significant. I definitely agree with the theory that Jacob and other guy are some kind of deity and that this whole thing is a game between them. Remember we've been told that there's a war coming and I suspect that they are the ones at war and Ilana, Widmore and company are all just pawns.

On the statue: Someone in another thread I was in while watching the show theorized that it's not Anubis and then gave some information about Taweret and after reading that info and seeing the pics, I'm totally convinced.
And considering all the fertility issues on this island, that seems to fit.

That had to be the Black Rock. Jacob and other guy have obviously been here a long, long time.

I squeeled when Vincent came running out and the Rose/Bernard scene was so sweet it made my teeth hurt. In a good way. They are so full of love for each other.

It appears that Ilana and company are working for Jacob after all. Whether that means they are the good guys- well who knows? It certainly appears that Jacob is the good entity at this point but like I said earlier, there's a war coming and Jacob has definitely gotten Ilana and company to fight on his side.

I'm not sure Jacob was really trying to be cold to Ben in that scene- I think if it's true that he is some kind of God - and the weaving thing definitely seems to fit that theory on top of everything else we've seen - then as a God of course his perspective would be that in the scheme of things Ben is quite insignificant - so Ben, what about you, indeed?

And finally, I seriously almost cried when Juliet was hanging on and Sawyer was trying to save her. That scene was gut-wrenching.

HorribleLicensePlates said...

It was awesome!

I am craving an Apollo right now, in fact.


Ok, finally back and able to respond to all these great LOST-related comments!

@ April, in response to your first comment: Until you actually spelled it out for me, I did NOT make the connection that the loophole was what allowed the Not-Jacob Dude to come back to have Jacob killed! Great observation (and man, I'm so dense sometimes!). Here's the thing, though: Locke's body is in the box that Ilana has. So did the loophole allow for ANOTHER "Locke's body" to be created, and for the Not-Jacob Dude to inhabit it?

Also, if the real Locke is actually dead, that would mean that his last moments on earth were first of him being despondent enough to try to commit suicide, and then of Ben actually killing him. If that's the case, I'd be really sad (although I wouldn't MIND if that were the case, as it'd make for a great part of the story). Locke has already been touched by so much tragedy that I'd hate for him to not get any real redemption and to have his last moments be as tragic as much of the rest of his life was.


@ Ranielle: Kudos for staying awake for the whole finale (migraine be damned)! :)

I, too, am sad that we have to wait SO LONG for more Lost. I'd say Season 6 had better be damn good to make up for the wait, but we pretty much already know it will be, right?

Re: the they're just messin' with us. :)

You're welcome for the eye candy! Mmm, shirtless Sawyer!

I completely forgot about the weaver thing, mainly because I didn't understand its significance. I really like your thoughts regarding weaving the threads of life; that seems very appropriate here. (I, too, thought of Sleeping Beauty at first!)

Yeah, it wouldn't surprise me at all if Richard came to the island on The Black Rock. But how did Jacob and Non-Jacob Dude get to the island, and why were they there, and what did Jacob do to piss off the N-JD and make the N-JD want to kill him?

When we caught that glimpse of Jacob in "Cabin Fever" a while back, I swore Jacob looked older and a little more scruffy than this guy. I figured maybe they gave us such a fleeting glimpse of Jacob in that earlier episode so that they'd have more flexibility in casting Jacob for a later episode, you know?

* Thank you for explaining that loophole thing and that Locke is not really Locke...that went over my head a little bit while I was watching last night! :) I wonder why that guy can't kill Jacob and had to have Ben try to do it instead...

* I *love* the idea that Jacon and N-JD are both gods!

* I missed that Jacob touched all the castaways before they were on the island--great catch! (Didn't Sawyer finish that letter, though? I could have sworn he did, but I might be mixed up. I'll have to check the Lost wiki later on.)

* I, too, thought that Locke had been brought back to life and had found his purpose on the island, but if this creepy version of Locke isn't really Locke, then that idea is shot to hell, which begs the question: What is/was Locke's purpose? And what does this mean for Jack, who has newfound faith in Locke?

* I love how Juliet was the hero of the episode, finally making that bomb work. Her performance was absolutely brilliant in every scene she was in last night.

* I thought Miles totally made sense, too!

* Man, if Jacob's not dead, he's gonna be mighty angry once he pulls himself outta that fire. Can't wait to see what happens with that...

* I, too, wanted to see Claire or Christian around the cabin last night. I've heard we'll see Claire again in season 6--hopefully that's true...

Hope your migraine has gone away and that you're feeling better! :)


@ Andrew: I'm not 100% convinced that Juliet's dead, but I feel like there's a good chance that she is. Especially since I've heard she's gonna be on another TV show... ;) You do bring up a good point about Desmond not dying in a similar situation, though!

Now that I actually get it, yeah, I also like the "Locke isn't really Locke" twist, too. :)

I was actually annoyed that Ben didn't have more to say/do, but I thought his performance at the end of the episode was FABULOUS. I love that character more and more each time I see him. Michael Emerson is SO talented!


@ April: Great theory on the statue! I just checked out the Wikipedia link and I think this part is really interesting: "In Egyptian mythology, Taweret... Her name means (one) who is great. When paired with another deity, she became the demon-wife of Apep, the original god of evil. Since Apep was viewed as residing below the horizon, and only present at night, evil during the day then was envisaged as being a result of Taweret's maleficence."

Rose and Bernard are so good and genuine. I love them. :) They are so optimistic!

I'm very curious as to what Ilana and her buddies are up to. I don't know if they're the good guys are not. If they're the good guys, then are our castaways some of the bad guys, or just pawns in this whole crazy mess?

I have a tough time believing that Ben is insignificant, though. Maybe Ben pissed Jacob off and that's why Jacob didn't feel like being just a wee bit nicer to Ben, when he clearly needed SOME sort of affirmation... (Man, Ben's got some real RAGE in him, doesn't he???)

The Sawyer/Juliet/hatch scene was gut-wrenching, indeed. That was a FANTASTIC scene. Wow.


@ Horrible License Plates: Ooh, now I kinda want an Apollo bar too, haha! :)

Ranielle said...

I'm such a dummy! I totally forgot that Possibly-Evil Lock pushed Jacob into that fire.

BUT -- if Possibly-Evil Locke is actually N-JD in disguise, and N-JD is not allowed, for whatever reason, to kill Jacob, did pushing him into the fire finish the job? I can't remember if the stab wounds from Ben actually offed him or if Jacob was still conscious when pushed into the fire. Anyone?

Are the white light from the Island's magnetic energy force and the white light of a hydrogen bomb the same thing, or are they different things?

The conversation at the very beginning of the episode between Jacob and N-JD is, I believe, laced with all kinds of significance. N-JD is pissed because Jacob is causing this ship to come to the Island. For whatever reason, Jacob is the one bringing people to the Island, and N-JD doesn't want them there. N-JD is pissed that people come to the Island, make war, and then destroy themselves (or something along those lines). Which makes me think that Jacob has been bringing people to this Island long before the Black Rock (if that ship out there is, indeed, the Black Rock.)

Sawyer may have indeed finished that letter, now that I think about it. I could have been stretching.

April said...

I almost forgot this but there was that part where Locke told Richard they were going to take care of the rest of the group from Flight 316 and when Richard asked all Locke said was "what do you think it means?"

It certainly seems that other-dude-in-Locke's-body intends to kill everyone that is on Jacob's side. Even those that have no idea they are on his side.

Season 6 is going to rock!

Phrank said...

OK what about some eye candy for the guys?!?!


@ Ranielle: If Jacob really IS a god, I'm guessing that maybe Ben/Bad Locke didn't really kill him...

Also: Doc Jensen (in the recap they posted not too long ago at did a great analysis of Jacob and N-JD's conversation from the beginning of the episode. I agree--that conversation was loaded with significance! Jensen's ideas/interpretations of it are all pretty interesting...


@ April: Yeah, I assume that means that Bad Locke wants to kill Ilana and all her buddies. Can't wait to see what happens with that next season!


@ Phrank: I added some Kate eye candy onto today's post. :) Nothing too racy, since I'm at work, but I thought it was a good picture!

Dave said...

Wow - You weren't kidding when you said you had a post to write! Don't worry - I didn't ready ANY of it. I did however rate it 5 out of 5, due to the inclusion of some very guy oriented eye candy hahaha


@ Dave: Epic episode, epic-sized post, and SO many awesome comments today! :) Glad you liked the eye candy, and I'm VERY glad you didn't read any of the post! Once you get all caught up on season 5, you can come back and read all the RPI Lost posts... :)

Dave said...

I think I will...I'm sure I will have a lot to say on the subject!

michael said...

Doing this from a differnt computer than usual, so if this doesn't show up properly, this is michael.

My internet is finally working properly! I had to watch the comment numbers jump from 3 to 7 to 14 before I could actually see what they were!

So most of my thoughts have already been voiced, but I do have a couple of things to add.

The ash around the cabin being disturbed means that whatever was trapped in there could get out. N-JD, or I'm a monkey's uncle. That's why he always looked scruffier, like N-JD. Also, "Jacob" (now we know was actually N-JD) asked Locke to help him. Clearly for revenge, but Locke probably didn't really know what was going on. Richard does, and the reason why Ben was confused when stuff started flying around the cabin was because he never knew about a second deity.

So N-JD finds his loophole by enlisting someone else to kill Jacob. The "shadow of the statue" people were trying to find N-JD the whole time, because they had the evidence that Locke wasn't who he said he was. That's why they were freaking out about the ash.

I might be confusing this with something else I watched recently, but weren't Hurley and Miles talking about "can good exist without evil" or the other way around? Well, that was the writers hitting us over the head with a second "deity" on the island.

Next question is, who's "side" (if any) is Smokey on? Is it its own entity? All of the egyptian stuff on the island - ancient people brought by Jacob? They seem to have built a temple to worship the smoke monster, and that statue with the chamber ceratinly didn't build itself. Ben knew his way around Smokey, more or less, but not Jacob, and presumably didn't know about N-JD. BUT Smokey as Alex told Ben NOT to interfere with "Locke," and there is no reason to think that something like Smokey wouldn't know about everything else going on.

And what about those numbers?

As to the bomb, the white light from the H-Bomb and the white light from the electro-magnetic blast are two different things, I think. Both a massive release of energy, but to different ends. Milse had a really good point, but I think Faraday would have considered that already. I hope. We've beaten the time-travel theory debate to death, but beyond that I think what happened with Desmond and the button was more in line with the incident before Juliet started beating a bomb with a rock. Loved that, by the way.

So to try to summarize, I like the ide that there are good AND evil (instead of everyone looking for reasons to shoot each other, thanks Bernard!), but I wouldn't go so far as to say that they are two among many gods involved. I think that would go a little over the top. But Jacob and N-JD are definitely stronger than the average bear, if you know what I mean.

And as for the "incident," it would be a real letdown, not to mention waste of time, if nothing changed because of the bomb and everyone there just died. Even though this finale and last week showed us that a lot of the time-travel business "already happened," I think it is important to note that all of it was surrounding Richard, who is also special. So I'm looking for at least some sort of change, even if it doesn't make any sense at first.


@ Dave: I don't doubt it! Season 5 was a really exciting season that gives us SO much to consider going into the final season...


@ Michael: Hooray for properly-functioning internet! :D

Yes, the more I think about it, I agree that the person in the cabin (in season 4, I think?) was N-JD, not Jacob himself. Crazy! All along we'd just assued that was Jacob...oh,those Lost writers are so tricky...

Also, in the latest Doc Jensen recap, he talks briefly about how the N-JD reminds him of...SMOKEY?!? Hmmm...I wonder if he's onto something there...?

I don't specifically remember that Hurley/Miles conversation, but it certainly sounds like something they might say (maybe that was part of their discussion about Star WARS? That could fit...), and that would be some great foreshadowing about that second deity...

I, too, am wondering about the numbers. They didn't touch on that at all last night. (Or on Desmond, Claire, or Waaaaaalt!--all of whom I'm hoping will show up in Season 6 to answer some questions for us...)

Yeah, I highly doubt everyone there just died because of the bomb blast. I don't think they're getting rid of Kate, Sawyer, or Jack anytime soon. If the underlying theme of the show is redemption, those 3 must be in season 3--they're totally caught up in the redemption idea...

I want to know more about Richard, why he's special, who he really is... I hope we get more details about him in season 6. I think he could be the key to finding out SO many things...

Crane said...

"Our favorite hot redneck"? You mean your favorite hot redneck. My favorite is Roy Oswalt.


Ha! I had no idea that more than one hot redneck even *existed*. Thanks for making me aware of this! :)

Phrank said...

@Grammarphile - Thanks!! :) lol


You're quite welcome! :)

Kati M. said...

Wow, everyone came up with some great stuff! I'm sad that I'm always a day behind.

So, as I was reading Ranielle's first comment, yet somehow before I got to the part at the end where she mentioned Christian and Claire, I had an epiphany.

We are all in agreement based on obvious evidence that Bad Locke and N-JD are one and the same. Has anybody thought about the fact that CHRISTIAN might be N-JD? The only issue there is that Christian and Locke were both on the island in the more present time at the same time when Sun and Lapidus went to the Dharma camp (where Christian then told them to wait for Locke, whom they didn't know was alive). Otherwise, I think it fits quite well and under the same circumstances as Locke. Christian's body was buried on the island by Jack, yet somehow he's alive again. hmmm.

michael said...

Looking back, I think Christian has been more helpful than harmful. I wouldn't necessarily be able to point out many specific examples, but I can't think of anything he did that goes along with N-JD's m.o. Helping Locke turn the wheel was for the good of all of the people on the island. If he represented N-JD, he would have been, "screw it, they'll all die this way."

So now I'm not so sure about Christian being Smokey. But anything can happen.


@ Kati and Michael: Ooh, you each make some very good points about Christian. I think there's definitely something going on with Christian--perhaps he, too, was touched by Jacob and now he's been made a similar sort of magical to Richard Alpert?--but since I get a *good* vibe from him when he shows up on the island (keeping Claire company, helping Locke turn the donkey wheel), my guess is that he isn't Smokey. But who knows? :) We have quite a few months to wait to find out the answers to all of this...

Magnolia said...

I'm late to the party! Enjoying everyone's comments, though.

One thing that occurred to me with the "loophole" business -- isn't there a similarity to Ben and Widmore here? Ben can't kill Widmore, right? Wasn't that established when Ben left the Island and told Widmore he was going to kill Penny? Ben would need a loophole, like not-Jacob needed to find in order to kill Jacob.

I cried my eyes out when Juliet fell, and when she made the bomb go off! For someone that started out with suspect motives, she really grew to be part of heart of the series for me.

Miles saving his dad! So great! I loved how he even called him "Dad"!

I was shocked at the reveal of Locke's corpse. Truly did not see it coming.

I'm sure there's more, but it's hard wrapping my mind around all of this!


Glad you finally got to watch the episode! Great observation, comparing Ben/Widmore to Jacob/Not-Jacob, in terms of how one can't kill the other unless there's a loophole...

It's been a few days since I saw the finale, and I *still* can't stop thinking about it and thinking over all sorts of theories...haha! :)